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US Military Asking Soldiers if They Would Shoot Americans
Submitted by: Clell Adams

There are 103 comments on this story
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U.S. troops are being trained to conduct round-ups, confiscate guns and shoot American citizens, including their own friends and family members, as part of a long-standing program to prepare for the declaration of martial law, according to a soldier who recently returned from Iraq.

...

The issue of whether U.S. troops would be prepared to round-up, disarm and if necessary shoot Americans who disobeyed orders during a state of martial law is a question that military chiefs have been attempting to answer for at least 15 years.

Its known origins can be traced back to an October 1994 Marine questionnaire out of the Twentynine Palms Marine Base in California. Recruits were asked 46 questions, including whether they would kill U.S. citizens who refused to surrender their firearms.

Submitter's note: Can any of you comment on this from a personal perspective?

Comment by: tkampert@cox.net (2/5/2008)

Not a surprising question at all. Of course they want soldiers to be able to shoot fellow Americans. How else will Clinton or Obama enforce their personal agenda to turn this country into a Socialist state if either is elected? Tell ya what though. There's gonna be one hell of a big surprise in store for anyone who tries to do so. There are MANY MORE of US than there are ot THEM...and we intend to FIGHT. Our Constitution is sacred, and we will either live BY it, or die FOR it. It's that simple.

Comment by: MACpistol.com (2/5/2008)

Let's get down to the hard cold reality that 99% of americans REFUSE to deal with: the federal "government" behaves in this out of control fashion because only a small percentage of americans own high capacity semi automatic rifles and even worse, there are only a handful of local militias left. During Katrina, there should have been a dozen local militias that mustered to protect their neighborhoods. The gangs would have gone elsewhere and the gangs with badges would have had to rethink their gun confiscation strategy.

Comment by: MACpistol.com (2/5/2008)

I doubt the government thugs and cowards would have even tried pulling guns from the hands of old ladies like they did. The "national rifle association" is 100% against local militias and has supported lists of gun bans since 1934, DO NOT JOIN THIS ORGANIZATION if you value the 2nd amendment. The nra never EVER pushes "Vermont/Alaska" carry even in states like Wyoming and Montana where IT WOULD BECOME LAW. It just gets worse from Katrina folks, so wake up. Just wait till the federal "government" sends BLACKWATER against american citizens after the next disaster. Do you want that?

Comment by: MACpistol.com (2/5/2008)

Make them think twice about it by getting several "assault" weapons, several thousand rounds of ammo, and getting your neighbors/friends/family off their television watching ASSES to do the same. The future is not set and our nation is heading in a very dangerous direction thanks to the globalists who control the U.S. "government," and are bush's handlers (he's just a moronic script reader).

Comment by: C4 (2/5/2008)

YYes,TK, there are many more of US than THEM but they are organized and we are not. They will hit whole neighborhoods simultaneously which would prevent us from getting into a position of defense {unless you live in a castle} Also there would be freeze on the news media to prevent neighborhoods from organizing against them. To be sure,once we start popping them, they wont be too happy with us and will act accordingly

Comment by: Tim (2/5/2008)

They'll hit Us like a Fall Turkey Hunt. Some How they'll Scatter the Flock . Then make it so many will want to come to their callings(Out of need).

Comment by: uncledude45@hotmail.com (2/5/2008)

We should start sending emails asking the service members how many American citizens they will be killing while other service members are killing their Parents and siblings.

Comment by: Tim (2/5/2008)

many people donto even know that. Under current Laws. Schools will have Police stationed at all schools in a national Emergency. Even if there isn't a real threat! You will not be able to come to the schools and take Your Kids home. You will be turned away. And if You do come to the school for Your Kids in a Publicised(By Radio and/Or TV)
NATIONAL EMERGENCY! You'll be ARRESTED!
For coming to get Your own Kids?
Who the hell do they think THEY ARE? I have a suprise for them if they try something Like this, to put control over us by way of our children.

Comment by: Tim (2/5/2008)

ALSO! I read That In a Government sanctioned National Emergency. You are Not tolive Your House if the National threat threat level Monitor is at RED.
You will be arrested also for That.
It's In the Patriot act somewhere. In the amendments on it.

Comment by: Tim (2/5/2008)

corrections: ALSO! I read That In a Government sanctioned National Emergency. You are Not to leave Your House if the National threat level Monitor is at RED.
You will be arrested also for That.
It's In the Patriot act somewhere. In the amendments on it.

Comment by: Bambi (2/5/2008)

Alas..alas....WE ARE DOOMED

Comment by: Tim (2/5/2008)

Quote: C4 (2/5/2008)
YYes,TK, there are many more of US than THEM but they are organized and we are not. They will hit whole neighborhoods simultaneously which would prevent us from getting into a position of defense {unless you live in a castle} Also there would be freeze on the news media to prevent neighborhoods from organizing against them. To be sure,once we start popping them, they wont be too happy with us and will act accordingly

RE: That's correct! All the stores will be closed. There will be No running to the local store for food, etc. Many people will be quit shaken Up.
The Video doesn't show That effect. Because the people in the excersise. Weren't under the Impression this could or would be really happening to Them.

Comment by: Tim (2/5/2008)

Bambi (2/5/2008)
Alas..alas....WE ARE DOOMED

This ISN'T a GAME! This $_ _ T is really happening!
And it isn't a conspiracy THEORY!
It's a conspiracy FACT!
It is a Conspiracy By Our own Government to allow a Foreign take over of our Country.
As those In power aqueous to Their(Wealthy Elites) demands for surrender and Policy making Over America.

Comment by: Vote Ron Paul (2/5/2008)

If Ron Paul doesn't get the numbers today it is proof that America is no longer the home of the brave and the sheople are afraid to be free.
The "wasted vote" is the one cast for any one else-basically liberals in conservative clothing.

Comment by: Tim (2/5/2008)

Here's How I investigate someone in governments, actions.
First I read Up as Much as I can on what they(Government spokesman/Women) proposes or are proposing by way of (Law)
Then I read as many Pro and Con articles on their actions By other people.
I separate the assumptions and the facts in each type of pro /con article written on the subject(person).
Then I ask my self Who benefits by this/these
action(s)
99% of the time Government is the only one that benefits from current actions being taken When speaking about law making.
The people keep losing everything.
Their Jobs, etc.
Their rights and abilities to make their own personnal choices.
The relavance of what is taking place gets clearer & clearer.

Comment by: uncledude45@hotmail.com (2/5/2008)

You are only going to get one gun fight, just like the folks in Waco TX did. If they had not been armed, they would have been murdered the very first afternoon. Then there was Ruby Ridge ID. I also remember seeing a little old lady in Louisiana fighting to keep her hand gun. The point I'm trying to make is that no one cares about anyone else. "As long as they leave me alone, I don't care what they do" But they won't leave me alone, or you. They are after all of us. It's true that there are more of us than them, but as long as we are seperate, they win hands down, and we don't have the balls to ban together and stand up agianst the likes of Hillary Clinton and her wife Bill, or Obammy, or whatever his name is.

Comment by: self preservation (2/5/2008)

Tim:
With government being the largest single employer in many areas, is it any wonder why the public votes the way it does. Even though they all took an oath, it is no longer about what is good for America- each one is simply voting to preserve his/her own corrupt position.
Remember the famous quote (paraphrased): democracy can only survive until the people realize that they can vote for their own raises- that is what is happening with our government employees today.

Comment by: GeorgeMason1776@aol.com (2/5/2008)

This is typical Alex Jones zombie horse excrement. The Cunningham survey in the 90s was done at the instigation of a Marine officer who wanted to make the point with Marines that there were unconstitutional orders. As far as this story, its source, like almost everything else Alex Jones pimps, is unverifiable. Believing and reacting to disinformation merely discredits your cause.

Here's the central fact about Iraq: it is the training ground and laboratory for this generation's armed citizenry. The best of the young people of this country are being schooled for future action back at home if some tyrant decides to get froggy. It is certainly the latest example of the Law of Unitended Consequences.

Comment by: dtmb (2/5/2008)

Perhaps it WAS just an experiment but, if enough of the dummies answer "yes" (most of them aren't very well schooled in such matters), the government might find a use for them.

Comment by: LIBERTY FOREVER!!! (2/5/2008)

Re: George Mason, "This is typical Alex Jones zombie horse excrement."

So.............. THAT was excrement that I was watching video of during Katrina in New Orleans. THAT NEVER REALLY HAPPENED??? That soldier NEVER said that It scared him thinking that he might have to shoot American citizens??? THEY RALLY DIDN"T GO DOOR TO DOOR CONFISCATING GUNS AND RESTRAINING GUN OWNERS???

OH THANK GOODNESS-!!

WHAT A RELIEF!!!

Comment by: noemail@noemail.com (2/5/2008)

Submitter's note: Can any of you comment on this from a personal perspective?

Anyone with past or present military experience have firsthand knowledge of any "training" to use military force against U.S. Citizens?

Comment by: tkampert@cox.net (2/5/2008)

Maybe this was just an experiment...at the onset. However, since then, things have taken a drastic turn towards the dark side. There are un-Constitutional orders given to Police officers every day..and THEY took an oath of office also...that are followed to the letter. There WILL be members of our Armed Forces who WILL follow un-Constitutional orders..especially the mid ranking officers who are looking at careers and promotions. Don't stick your head in the sand. It CAN happen. It DID happen in New Orleans. It's up to US to see that it NEVER happens again.

Comment by: enoughsaid (2/5/2008)

I was stationed in Iraq and we did do house to house searches mostly looking for "terrorists" and weapons that were banned. Was never asked if Id do this to Americans, if I had been I believe I wouldve been court marshalled for laying down a serious beating.

Comment by: Trapper (2/5/2008)

A good friend of mine was in the Marine Corps in the late 70's to 1990. He told me that he personally never got a questionaire. He did say that the questionaire did run a course thru some Marines, but also the rest of the branches. He was told, hillary clinton promoted this in Arkansas, on a more local level, and got 10% that said yes. He said it was 2nd hand news to him. He told me this 2 years ago during summer gunsmithing courses. He isnt the type to just make up a story and lie about it. He just didnt know what the gov. was up to, as to why they would conduct such a test. In other words, isnt that question rather extreme, firing upon Americans? Anyways, off to vote.

Comment by: Trapper (2/5/2008)

Speaking of voting, the last 5 days, Hitlery and Osama YoMama Obama has been bombarding the airwaves with their slime, 3 (each) times per hour. Not one Republican has had t.v. time. I thought Ron Paul would have one, but he didnt. Seems strange. Ron will get my vote. A vote thrown away?...I will vote my principles.

Comment by: leanman@yahoo.com (2/5/2008)

Having relatives currently in the military, I can tell you that not ALL those folks will follow such un-Constitutional orders. Many folks in the military, especially from the South, realize the ramifications of such orders and won't obey. Some of course will try to enforce such and will be dealt with on a local level. There are those who will comply, but when it hits the fan, so to speak, there will be many in the civilian sector that will rise up to the occasion and protect what is theirs.

Comment by: f_wiedner@hotmail.com (2/5/2008)

I'm calling total BS on this one.

I can't find anyone either active, reserve, or retired that has been or was ever asked this question.

... and I've been asking around.

Comment by: madashell (2/5/2008)

The questionnaire is real, what happened in New Orleans is real, plus Ive heard from former military personal that they believed they were being trained for gun confiscation and massive arrests of USA citizens.

Each one of us will have to make the decision on whether to believe this story or not.

We have a lot of new laws on the books that can make this a reality. When they come for the guns like they did in New Orleans more people are going to be awake aware and prepared than before.

look how quick the story about confiscation in New Orleans got out.

The only way they are going to stop the story from coming out again is to shut everything down at once. If that happens it will be a signal for action.

Comment by: rogerscott87176@yahoo.com (2/5/2008)

I was in the Army in 1965 when they held company meatings asking this very question. The replay was that we would shoot the officers first.

Comment by: johnhancock66@yahoo.com (2/5/2008)

Rogerscott: That is the correct answer.
Whether this is being done or not, we must be prepared and organized to ensure that we have the best chance at survival and prospering. It will take all the wisdom of the best and brightest to continue this experiment in Liberty.

Comment by: b.vonbesser@mchsi.com (2/5/2008)

So I guess F Weidner and Geroge Mason are the only two people left in America who didn't see the vidoes of the confiscations in NO. Or, are the two of you claiming that was all a staged video made in some studio? And the NRA / CCKBA lawsuit was fake too. And the guns confiscated aren't rusting away in a warehouse.

Comment by: ... (2/5/2008)

Soldiers are not being trained in constitutional law; they are being trained to follow orders (or die trying).

Comment by: CavTrpr (2/5/2008)

I was a 1LT with the 1st Cav in 1972-74, in Texas. A number of us, all CPTs and LTs, discussed what we would do if we were ordered to confiscate guns from Americans. We ALL agreed that we had taken an oath of office when we were commissioned, and that we had sworn "to protect and defend the CONSTITUTION of the United States". We agreed that an order to confiscate firearms would violate the 2nd and 5th Amendments of the Constitution. We would refuse any such order and would probably end up shooting anyone who gave us that order. The rest of the sheeple in this country may not take the Constitution seriously, but I will guaran-damn-tee that soldiers do. Why the @%&*@!!# do you think they are risking their lives for this country?

Comment by: scsmith2@bellsouth.net (2/5/2008)

To dismiss this story out of hand because it comes from a "conspiracy nut" is foolish. This is way too important a story to just ignore. In Ronald Reagan's words, "Trust, but verify."

If it does turn out to be the truth, as I suspect it will, this should be a wake-up call for all those sheeple slurping beer watching TV.

A related issue: I've been hearing stories that morons and psychopaths are being promoted in our military and police forces, while those who know the Bill of Rights and understand it are being marginalized. I've also heard unconfirmed rumors that illegal aliens are being recruited into the military and even police. Do you think these people would hesitate to shoot Americans?

Comment by: theaton@valornet.com (2/5/2008)

CavTrpr

Why the @%&*@!!# do you think they are risking their lives for this country?

Many that I talk to wanted a free education and a paycheck. They didn't expect and were horrified when they were ordered to Iraq. Karma is sometimes humorous!

Comment by: ... (2/5/2008)

Sure you guys think you are fighting for the second amendment but you will find out the first time that you visit a VA facility that the second amendment is out of print.

Comment by: markht@bellsouthdotnet (2/5/2008)

Does anyone doubt a significant number of troops would obey orders to confiscate guns????
Google "bonus marchers." If Ruby Ridge & Waco, and Katrina doesn't get across where this country is going.

With respects to "Cav Trpr"; I respect your experience, but I do not believe it represents the general conditions we have today.

Comment by: madashell (2/5/2008)

(I've also heard unconfirmed rumors that illegal aliens are being recruited into the military and even police.)

scsmith2... I remember reading stories several years ago that about 1/3 of our troops in Iraq are foreign born with many being Illegal.

In fact I remember 1 ABC story that talked about the military going to prisons and recruiting illegals.

Now the story was written to dispel the story about our military recruiting violent felons. The story made certain to point out that none of these prisoners (illegals) were violent felons.

Will these guys shoot USA citizens?

They have NO connections to our culture or our nation, so YES they will gladly blow our heads off.

Comment by: ChareltonHest -ta- atfabuse.com (2/5/2008)

I don't take Alex Jones seriously, but judging by the past, I'd say that the military would without a doubt be willing to "keep and peace" in an area such as NOLA.

And of course they would take firearms from people...you know, only "troublemakers". People that weren't leaving their homes when ordered, or seen walking with a gun(patrolling in an emergency).

As for the slow degradation of the RKABA, well that's a "law enforcement issue", and our local SWAT Gestapos already have that covered. We already see people getting raided for having unregistered machineguns. The police have no problem following those orders.

(Con't...)

Comment by: thomaspaine@commonsense.org (2/5/2008)

Ask that question in Berkeley, Kalifornia to the USMC and see what their answer is.

The terminally stupid sheeple of the left will learn to cherish the 2A when it's too late.

Of course the Marines could always say they would never shoot an American, but they would gladly put a slug into a communist insurrectionist or socialist secessionist.

Comment by: Tim (2/5/2008)

I think one of the most important aspects of this issue that many have missed.
Is the Fact that Foreign TROOPS will be involved in this type of Martial Law when it is Implemented.
Our troops have been serving with foreigners by their sides for quit awhile now. Even In Iraq/Afgahnistan.
The reason Our Government does this. Is to give Our American Troops a sense of Internationalism over Americanism. Duty to NATO.
I Believe NATO was Used to bring 9/11. Just Like NATO aided our Enemies in the Korean War/Vietnam.
People miss the fact that there's a Foreign element in Our Military Now.
Troops will be faced and struggle with the Loyalty issue. Loyatly to other servicemen.
Who are supposedly serving a higher cause.
con't

Comment by: ChareltonHest -ta- atfabuse.com (2/5/2008)

(...Con't)

We can't seem to get organized and we get hi-jacked often.

Outside of small pockets online, I can barely ever find true gun-owners that "Get it". They are either people who know about what is happening but think I am naive because I don't come to the same defeatist conclusions -due to the past attacks on us- as they do, or they are NRA-followers who firebreath "Gun-Rights" but want us to "appear responsible" by suporting things like the NICS.

Rarely do I find people who beleive things can still be done, are willing to put a vote behind it.

And then there are those that are so fed up with trying to get people organised, that they give up and become cynical...

Screw everyone else, and just do what you know is right.

C.H.

Comment by: Tim (2/5/2008)

Who was That Young American soldier that was almost kicked out of the service because he wouldn't take an Oath to the UN?
Is this still going on in Our US service? Taking Oaths to Foreign entities?
And Not to defend the US Constitution and Our BoR?

Comment by: Tim (2/5/2008)

Why does the Iran/Contra affair and Olie North and those hearings where people in our own Government would cause a closed mouth secretcy
clause on continiunty of government plans, in the discussions of that affair?
Because that would of Blown the real conspiracy against America WIDE OPEN!
Our real Enemies are in the Gate. ALREADY!
Theirs an INFO WAR going on.
It's a War for Your mind. (Or)
How You perceive what is really happening.
More men have died on the field of battle because they thought they had Won the Battle for their freedom, and became complacent . Ltting down their guard.
Our Founders Words Speaketh Volumes at theact.
That Once they realised FREEDOM. There would be Men who would work to destroy it, fom Inside.

Comment by: Tim (2/5/2008)

RE: HK-91-762MM -Saying One thing and doing it. Is a whole different ball game.
the problem for Our service men is. Will they be able to dicern between supposedly serving a Higher duty. (They'll be told that it's for the peoples good)
Over what Is truly right?
Look at the Soldiers in the Video at this training drill! They think what they are being trained for is a GOOD Thing.
It's a Brainwash. It's a TRICK! Make our troops think they are serving a higher cause. While the real ends are Hidden away as they are implemented against the People.

COME TO ATTENTION SOLDIER !
YOU HAVE YOUR ORDERS now FOLLOW THEM!

Comment by: Tim (2/5/2008)

con't- Well Guess what?
This Gov. brought on this War of terrorism to implement Machivellian Law making against Our constitutional Rights. Yet Our soldiers are still following ORDERS!!

Comment by: Tim (2/5/2008)

Well Guess WHAT!!!!
Our Federal Government along with CONGRESS has passed many UNCONSTITUTIONAL LAWS agains the Free people of these United States and Our TROOPS are STILL FOLLOWING ORDERS!

Comment by: Tim (2/5/2008)

SO!? Donot expect Me to take the words of serviceman who make Their livellyhood from the DEVILS themselves, as trust worthy!
You don't huh?
Wanna BET?
The IRS gets its Authority through Interpol and the UN!
Trust our Troops? When they give Me good reason too! I will!
I got the -uck out of the Service once I realised who I was really serving. And it wasn't the People of this COUNTRY!
And My Uncle who was an AWACS officer for 30 Years told me he was PROUD that I took the time to realise Just what Our Government has Become.
A subverter of Freedom!
That's the reason HE RETIRED also!
He got tired of seeing the TREASON against America!

Comment by: Tim (2/5/2008)

Oh by the way? My Uncle use to Fly U-2 spy missions over Kosovo! He use to TRAIN IRANIAN soldiers to Fly Helicopters and Jets. He use to Train RUSSIAN soldiers to Fly Jets! He use to TRAIN foreigners on How to attack America!
And I cannot repeat the stories He told me of Treason against America and americans because it would Put his LIFE in Jeopardy!

Comment by: AmySue@7mmWSMag (2/5/2008)

...... "Our Constitution is sacred, and we will either live BY it, or die FOR it. It's that simple."

Officers in the service now mistake loyalty to this government, or to King George as loyalty to the Constitution ...........

it is .....support and defend the CONSTITUTION!!!

Buy more guns , more ammo , be prepared ........

Comment by: Tim (2/5/2008)

WTFU! SWEET PEA!

Comment by: HK-91-762MM (2/5/2008)

Also please remember -The libs have a very low tolerance to take casualties-Kill a few hundred atf-fbi secret service and send there heads back to HQ. and Beleave me there desire to fight will go away fast-remember -Attack there families also, Commie ATF thugg comes back home after a day fighting constution protectors-and finds his families heads stuck on the fence posts and they will decide its not worth trying to take our rights ...

Comment by: American (2/5/2008)

Of course, they would. The military, like the police (who are just another military), will do the bidding of whomever pays them.

The military will hide behind "we're just doing our job," completely ignoring the question of the legitimacy of their job.

Comment by: Tim (2/5/2008)

RE: AmySue@7mmWSMag - AMEN AMY!

Comment by: Tim (2/5/2008)

RE: history WILL repeat itself -
It happened to WW1 Vets also.
After the War. vets were promised back pay and benefits for medical needs, etc. And they staged a rally in a PEACEFUL protest to demand they were given what they were Promised.
The US Government gave them(US WW1 VETS) Bullets, Batons and a good beating instead.
I believe 8 or 10, died.

Comment by: Tim (2/5/2008)

RE CAvtrpr - says, "Why the @%&*@!!# do you think they are risking their lives for this country? "

You risk Life & Limb for a Lie told as Truth. But was and Is a LIE!

Is Nation Building for Israel.

Comment by: 7mmguy (2/5/2008)

Tim - That be the 'Bonus Army'.

I'm trying to get my liberal wife to read 'Unintended Consequences'

Comment by: Umm, yeah, right (2/5/2008)

"will not be enforced"? Sure, I believe that- just like the thousands of gun control laws on the books now.

Comment by: info@GunShowOnTheNet.com (2/5/2008)

"...The Officers also are to exert themselves, to the utmost to prevent every kind of abuse to private property, or to bring every Offender, to the punishment he deserves; shameful it is to find that these men, who have come hither in defence of the rights of mankind, should turn invaders of it, by destroying the substance of their friends..."

"...In short, it is to be hoped, that men who have property of their own, and a regard for the rights of others, will shudder at the thought of rendering any Man's Situation, to whose protection he had come, more insufferable, than his open and avowed Enemy would make it, when by duty and every rule of humanity, they ought to Aid, and not Oppress..."

- G. Washington, 8/25/1776 to Israel Putnam.

Comment by: Tim (2/5/2008)

Israel is NOT the Promised Land. (Israel is a National Socialist theocracy/ Fourth Reich)

Guess what Is? That's right. The USA is the Promised FREE Land of God fearing Men who made their laws Under GOD!! Now EVILMEN sit in the Whitehouse and subvert Freedom/Gods law
And if We donot wake Up soon. We'll be Judged
and condemn for following these liars!

Comment by: motoboy (2/5/2008)

I do hope a few Americans were paying attention during the 2-month Mt., Carmel, TX, siege, (which was, after all, begun by the federals using the 1934 National Firearms Act, in which we were told we could not own the same firearms that the standing national military uses.

The actual flavor of the federal gunslinger makes no difference. They will all kill you and not lose sleep.

Comment by: Tim (2/5/2008)

Our Founding Fathers made a Covenant(US Constitution & Bill of Rights) with God our Heavenly Father/Creator). Israel is making their covenant with the Devil!

Comment by: Tim (2/5/2008)

"A fanatic is one who won't change his mind and won't change the subject. Winston Churchill"<<<< Words from a Man who helped US Bankers/Marketeers, involved with aiding Adolf Hitler.

Comment by: Tim (2/5/2008)

Israel= National SOCIALIST Theocracy = Covenant for SOCIALISM
USA= Constitutional Republic= Covenant with God for Natural God given Rights/Equality for ALL Men
CHOOSE!

Comment by: TheDude (2/5/2008)

Tim:
Get a grip.

Comment by: Tim (2/5/2008)

soˇcialˇism /ˈsoʊʃəˌlɪzəm/ Pronunciation Key - Show Spelled Pronunciation[soh-shuh-liz-uhm]
noun 1. a theory or system of social organization that advocates the vesting of the ownership and control of the means of production and distribution, of capital, land, etc., in the community as a whole.
2. procedure or practice in accordance with this theory.
>>>>3. (in Marxist theory) the stage following capitalism in the transition of a society to communism, characterized by the imperfect implementation of collectivist principles.<<<<

Comment by: Tim (2/5/2008)

RE:TheDude (2/5/2008)
Tim:
Get a grip.

I have a GRIP on it just Fine,.......... Thanks!

Comment by: trotter7@alltel.net (2/5/2008)

Something we all need to remember is the American Civil War. Americans were killing other Americans, 600,000 dead before it was all over. Orders were given and followed on both sides to kill the enemy, even if he was your brother or nephew. Over the secession of several Southern States, completely within their rights as sovereign states under the Constitution. Lincoln gave the orders and they were carried out. Think about it.

Comment by: GeorgeMason1776@aol.com (2/5/2008)

"Comment by: b.vonbesser@mchsi.com (2/5/2008)
So I guess F Weidner and Geroge Mason are the only two people left in America who didn't see the vidoes of the confiscations in NO."

Did I deny there were gun confiscations in NO? No. That was fact. Doing a "somebody said somebody said" about the military that cannot be verified, especially when it was said by somebody with a track record like Jones, IS horse excrement and shouldn't be believed. My son is on his second tour of Iraq. You don't even want to know what his reaction is to this. I repeat: the experiences of the men and women in Iraq work to the benefit of the Unorganized Militia, not to its detriment.

Comment by: . (2/5/2008)

"Americans were killing other Americans, 600,000 dead"
yeah, rather moot question..history has answered the question too many times..after the initial chaos and mayhem, 2 hardened sides emerge having both suffered grievous casualties daily..war's fugly.

- Defense
Ron Paul has received more campaign contributions from active-duty mil pers and his fellow vets than any of his opponents. He advocates a strong nat'l def, while opposing nation-building and undeclared "police actions." Frmr Pres R Reagan said that Ron Paul is "one of the outstanding leaders fighting for a stronger nat'l def. As a former Air Force off, he knows well the needs of our armed forces, and he always puts them first. We need to keep him fighting for our country."

Comment by: ... (2/5/2008)

And let us not forget the countless indigenous people killed by American soldiers during the Indian Wars. Soldiers are not trained in morality- they collect their rations and follow orders.

Comment by: The Old Chief (2/5/2008)

I took that oath to "defend the Constitution against all enemies, foriegn and domestic" The first time in 1949 and have repeated it several times since. I spent 30 years on active duty in the USN after my original enlistment in the Reserves. I have never been asked the question under discussion. Had the question been posed, my answer would be, then as now, absolutely and positively NO. Such an order would be patently unconstitutional. No one who has taken that oath and believes in it would follow such an order.

Comment by: (2/5/2008)

The problem is, Old Chief, YOU do not get to decide WHO the enemies are. You are TOLD who the enemies are (foreign or domestic-drug wars anyone?). If you do not obey your orders, you become one of the enemy.

Comment by: ray13thomas@peoplepc.com (2/5/2008)

The troops will not be sent to disarm law abiding americans. They will be sent to disarm and detain criminals, terrorist, drug pushers, whatever the Gov. wants to call us at the time. They have no easy to know that they are being lied to. It is easier to follow orders than to question authority. We have many cases throughout history where American milita/ military / police agencies have killed american citizens who were simpelly trying to live in peace.

Comment by: ChareltonHest -ta- atfabuse.com (2/5/2008)

The troops will not be sent to disarm law abiding americans. They will be sent to disarm and detain criminals, terrorist, drug pushers, whatever the Gov. wants to call us at the time.

Exactly.

This is why I fear even our own brethren in the military will disarm us. They won't know they are doing it.

C.H.

Comment by: A & O (2/5/2008)

C.H.
Sort of like the kind folks at the irs, huh? Thinking it's all legal and proper.

Bottom line is you have the basic right to self defense against any who violate your rights. Knowingly or unknowingly can be worked out after your rights are preserved.

Comment by: Tim (2/6/2008)

RE:GeorgeMason1776@aol.com- You do know what Our founding Fathers said about Foreign entanglements correct?
Blackwater and Our troops weren't involved with New Orleans Gun confiscation?
It was Only ALL OVER THE NEWS when it happened. Where Were You?
Did Like like How the Mexican Army was allowed to go to NO to bring Aid ?
You truly Just don't get what is happening Do ya George?
The transitions are based on a TOTALLy new type of brainwashing theory. Very subtle.
And It's been going on and At us for the Last .Oh? About 100 years.

Comment by: Tim (2/6/2008)

RE: I like whisky (2/5/2008)
YEP! And they started to change our Government Drastically, right around the time all the Founding Fathers had died or were getting very old in age.

Comment by: Tim (2/6/2008)

RE:I like whisky - Oh By the way. There's Noth'in Like a good ole shot of Sweet Smack, Virginian Sourmash.

Comment by: Tim (2/6/2008)

9/11 WAS an INSIDE JOB!
George Bush quote to reporter:
Reporter: What did Iraq have to do with 9/11?
Bush: What did who?
Reporter: What did Iraq have to do with 9/11?
Bush Uh? >>>>>>>>> NOTHING<<<<<<<<
Should I spell that word for You again in case You didn't go to school?
>>>>>>>>>>N O T H I N G !!!!<<<<<<<<<<<<,

Comment by: They can swear but can they read? (2/6/2008)

In conclusion, all it would take to get the elite military to shoot at Americans is to redefine the terms, much like the word is was redefined by a former president. WE are no longer "Americans"; we are now gun owners, moonshiners, drug dealers, white supremists, hispanics, tax cheats, or just plain protesters trying to exercise rights without the proper permission slips.

Comment by: frank einstein (2/6/2008)

in conclusion, george mason is correct. citing NO after Katrina has nothing to do with this so called survey. it is diversionary segway into conspiracy land. anyone who'd believe alex jones with a whole lot of corrobeoration is a fool. only idiots believe what they want to here without getting proof. there are a whole lot of idiots here.

Comment by: Tim (2/6/2008)

RE:frank einstein- I know what's wrong with YooooU!
Your Mom dropped You on Your head when ya was Born!

Comment by: frank einstein (2/6/2008)

not true tim. but she did teach me that when someone insists on making an idiot out of themselves the best thing you can do is get out of their way.

YOU HAVE THE FLOOR, YOU MAY PROCEED.

Comment by: ccouncell@aol.com (2/6/2008)

Please do not underestimate the american soldier, he maintains the morals learned from his family, and has taken his oath to defend the constitution very seriously. Even after retirement, I am still sworn to defend and I maintain the tools and training needed to do so. I am the MILITIA!

Comment by: Tim (2/6/2008)

ccouncell@aol.com (2/6/2008)
Please do not underestimate the american soldier, he maintains the morals learned from his family, and has taken his oath to defend the constitution

Which One ccouncel? The First ( Original) or the second 'Color of Law", constitution?

Comment by: Tim (2/6/2008)

The Truth Frank? People like you couldn't find their arse, if your thumb was stuck in it!

Forgive Me Lord. I couldn't resist........

Comment by: frank einstein (2/6/2008)

by golly, momma was right!

Comment by: frank einstein (2/6/2008)

and i suppose that's the only way you find yours, eh tim? THUMBS UP!!!

Comment by: frank einstein (2/6/2008)

oops, here he comes again. I better get outa his way. (thanks mom)

Comment by: Tim (2/7/2008)

RE:Trapper - EXCELLANT point ! Why would the Government survey our troops to see if they would shoot Americans? The ONLY reason is to see how Far they have been delusioned, and That Government Plans on making them do this.
Otherwise why would You ask a Soldier defending America this QUESTION?
What's Your intentions Uncle Sam?